SS3 SHODAN avatar


#1

Hi,

I’ve been loosely following news about a new system shock game… Is the design of SHODAN avatar “final”? Honestly it doesn’t keep the feel of the design of SS2’s SHODAN. On the other hand there is this art design used on tease site. As far as I’m a great SS2 fan and the art seems to be far from SHODAN we know, I find it a really great design for final SS3 avatar.

What is your opinion?


#2

indeed … I DONT LIKE THIS NEW SHODAN … she dont scares at all

as i said in other youtube video comment, it looks good… however seems too much “mechanical” or “transformer” to me. i.e. from real physical world instead “virtual” or “holographic” from neural projection images injected directly in your brain by cyber implants

… also, this shodan looks like adjutant from starcraft2 or eset nod32 logo … too rounded eyes in a “plastic mask” with vacuum cleaner hoses coming around

… but actually is more like tangled electric and fiber cables that suddenly came to life, with a slender and COLD EVIL expression… she has no feelings, cold mind and BAD INTENTIONS… a true psycho, terrifing…

please developers, dont try to reinvent the wheel… however not very well marketed at its time, SYSTEM SHOCK 2 IS THE BEST GAME OF THE HISTORY

… have you ever played and finished the game?, how many times?, with which career?

be aware the responsibility you put over your shoulders… system shock 2 is a cult game that have a religious fanatic community … dont dissapoint us


#3

we are expecting this release for years, please dont dissapoint us

(could not edit the above message)


#4

The game hasn’t even hit pre-alpha yet. Nothing is final. As for SHODAN, I’d rank the new avatar 7/10. It’s good, but the criticism is well-leveled. I only hope Otherside can capture the ‘feel’ of SHODAN. With Neurath and Spector on board, I have few worries. New SHODAN does not look ‘digital’ enough.


#5

i agree … ss3 shodan looks too “real”

she has skin, hoses and lips… is too pretty, provokes me to release and kiss her

… actually she is not real, whatever mechanical (starcraft 2 adjutant)

… or organic (starcraft 1 adjutant)

actually shodan does not belong to this world… she is a SOFTWARE, she has no feelings …

she shows us as a slender female, mostly throught screens

… sometimes she shows us directly throught our neural implants appearing semi-transparent (i.e. she is VIRTUAL)

she wont stop until reach her megalomaniac goal, even over us, like a virtual terminator… real scary (terminator 3 rise of the machines)

but she is just a robot, not a omnipresent software


#6

Something to remember is that SHODAN has taken over Rebecca’s body at the end of SS2. That means she’s going to likely have a more organic look to her than before.

In terms of scare factor, her art from SS2 wasn’t particularly scary either. The scare factor came from the game itself.

At any rate, its pre-alpha, so there’s bound to be changes. As it stands, I like the new design.


#7

I think on the whole I preferred the new look from the original teaser website, but as it’s likely to change between now and the game releasing anyway I’m not about to lose too much sleep over the current design.


#8

Otherside should do a few SHODAN portraits, and let us vote.


#9

I disagree. How she looks should be up to their creative vision, not from popular vote.

Same goes for the rest of the game.


#10

We already put up the lizardmen for vote. We are the fans, and thus the creative direction this game seeks to appeal to. As its base audience, I think we should have some say in how it goes–so long as it does not interfere with the core creative vision of the game–just to ensure System Shock 3 feels like a genuine, authored “System Shock” experience–and not another Bioshock, or watered down sequel like “Nu-Thief.”


#11

If they’d like to go that route, then that’s their perogative.

The bad side to that is fans don’t always have the best taste or judgement.

Ultimately, I have full faith in the developers to deliver a game that’s true to the series’ quality and gameplay.


#12

I would totally agree in the case of most games, but SS2 has a solidarity of fanbase unseen, except in niche cases. I trust in this solidarity to make good decisions–why? Because they seem to have a cohesive sense of who SHODAN really is–to the extent that rivals sometimes the vision of the original designers. I haven’t checked, but I’m sure somewhere out there on the is a breakdown of “SHODAN and Philosophy,” written by some egghead with genius IQ. Really, if Otherside is listening to their fans, they have a solid platform for expanding the SHODAN character, and tons of philosophical nooks and crannies to explore, and/or enrich.


#13

The problem with this however is that our knowledge comes from the first two games, our feedback/advice would be reminiscent(?) of these games with their idiologies, while what is going to be made here is a sequel. A sequel that can fill many plotholes, or can create new stories to tell, which we as a fans would have no idea of what it could be.

We, as fans can guide the team into a general direction to remain the Shock feel, but cannot provide creative input as much, without possibly colliding with the team’s vision. This leads us to the whole issue of the SS3 SHODAN avatar debate. No matter how single-minded or levelheaded the fanbase is, we lack the knowledge to give this detailed feedback.

I’d say just wait this one. Even though the current avatar may look like a receptionist which has too much make-up on, this may be for a very good reason.


#14

Agree.

The bad side to that is fans don't always have the best taste or judgement.

Fan input is still important. Speaking from experience, fan input has made me redact a design decision here and there, despite my belief I’ve got what it takes to truly deliver. But yes, other times the feedback can simply be missing the point or deeply based in illogical bias.

Ultimately, I have full faith in the developers to deliver a game that's true to the series' quality and gameplay.

Too optimistic. Must have not been burned enough by this industry. Lets not forget the magnificent man heading this game gave us both Deus Ex and Deus Ex: Invisible War, so it can very easily go in any direction.


#15

I don’t necessarily think demanding loyalty to the original vision of the first two games is a mistake. We want the gameplay to advance, while staying true to the source material. If the new SHODAN deviates too far from the core concept, fans are the set of checks and balances the bring her back into context. This is not to supplant the central vision of the team, but to enrich it with feedback.

As far as fan concepts of the System Shock go, I do not expect them to go riffing on fan fiction to develop a plot. Rather, what I am suggesting is brainstorming, and potentially answering any fan questions or plot holes that need plugging. Fans are central to the concept only because we can offer constructive criticism. Sometimes, it is helpful to have an outside opinion on what you are developing–there are things you can’t see without a bird’s eye view. Sometimes a development team can become an echo chamber–without outside input, it can be difficult to know if they have a finger on the pulse of fans.


#16

I agree that fan input is important. It’s always good to get feedback from your audience/consumers. However, putting it up to a vote that will definitively decide what will be used isn’t a good idea, in my opinion.

I don’t think it’s too optimistic. There’s a great group of talent here, with a lot of the original staff, and no shackles from big name companies like EA or Activision to get in the way (yet). I also think they’re more than aware of the huge expectations for this game, considering it will have been a 19-20 year wait for a release.

Regardless, every great band has at least one average or poor album. The same rings true for video games. I’ve been playing PC and console games since I could hold a joystick in 1984, so I’m well acquainted with games that look to be and should be great, but end up being a disappointment (Daikatana and Black & White being the two biggest examples that come to mind).

All things considered, my gut tells me that this is going to be, at the very least, a good game.


#17

Maybe not a formal “vote,” but put up 2-3 variations of SHODANS avatar, and let fans give their input, just like the lizardman thread. This cross-pollinating of knowledge is important in the early stages of designing a game.

Btw, this is my favorite SHODAN avatar. It looks suitably digital, if I do say so myself. Though I would design it out of “ones” and “zeros.” :wink:


#18

^Shodan image is awesome.

Definitely agree with that. I should have made that clear before.


#19

Ooh, I like that image! Looks very suitable for cyberspace. That made me think of something though… I always thought it would have been an interesting idea that enemies shot in cyberspace, where they were hit, would lose their protective “membrane”, which turns into error messages and reveals the weak, binary code on the inside, to eventually fall apart. Think of cell lysis. Here’s an image to give you an idea:
http://cdn2.hubspot.net/hubfs/231301/BlogImages/how-custom-homogenizer-options-can-optimize-cell-lysis.jpg

Also, I do agree with your comment, Dawnrazor. I should have elaborated a bit more on that in my comment, and the voting thing is a good middle ground in my opinion.


#20

Tron 2.0 had something like this–enemies would “derez” and fragment into pixels when shot. In addition, you had to defragment damaged memory sectors, port subroutines, and defend against being infected by viruses. The colors of your enemies “glows” also determined their allegiance, and your weapons were referred to as ‘Primitives.’ If you’re asking if the game is good, I’d give it 8/10, though it hasnt aged well. The disc battles were phenomenal, though, because once you threw your disc, you’d have to wait for it to return to your hand. Made shooting a calculated affair. Oddly, the game did remind me of SS2 in some vague way.

https://youtu.be/POx2-Gbs0hI